Site reformation
 

With FreezeWarp's an ex-administrator's departure, we are completely reforming the forum, the projects associated with it, and the chat.

For now, all I prefer to say regarding projects is that Mario Minus World is going to be revived as a purely database-driven website, and there will be a new project titled "VRAC."

There will also be a staff reform soon.

Any ideas at all, drop a message on the forum suggestions thread or create a new thread on that board.

For chat ideas, view this thread: http://victoryroad.net/showthread.php?t=9168

VR needs more friendly staff members that are more down to earth instead of people always watching others as it feels like for me, have the staff be like an ordinary Joe, like me.

Calm, rational, fun-loving. you know stuff that makes people like other people.

I'll call your Friendlier Staff proposition, and raise you one further: I think specifically, we need more staff members that are more willing to send a nice welcome message to new members, make them feel more welcome. I see a couple people doing that, and I do it myself, but rarely do I see actual Staff members sending a personal note that they're glad the new member's on board. You know what I'm saying?

They won't do this when the Disabled post count for the introduction thread still exists, we need a moderator for that board because of useless posts like: "Welcome to VR" just to get a higher post count.

This might be true, but we can't follow each and every new member. It is harder than what you think.

Y'know, from what I've seen as a staff member, I feel like we've always been friendly and fun around the forum, while still keeping within the rules for the most part. If you go look at some other forums, moderators barely interact at all with the community other than notifying someone that they broke the rules and correcting them. Staff members here aren't afraid to post around or say "Hi" on the chat.

That's one thing that I've been regretting lately. I haven't been all that active except in speicifc parts of the forum and chat, and I really feel like I've been avoiding a lot of people, particularly the new folks. I plan to become more active and show everyone I still care.

If it was still summer more of thought thread would have more people welcoming them, although I hardly post in the intro anymore, I see Shadow, Spirit, Ditto, and sometimes Kaz doing it. If there more staff member I didn't say, I am sorry but I hadn't been in that board forever.

Anyways I hope these new projects bring more users.

I like these reformations as it usually seems to fix a lot of problems in general. We should have one once a year.

I usually do say a polite welcome, and offer help if needed (then I do say even though I'm not staff I can help), but if what your looking for is a welcoming staff I think that would be unnecessary unless it gets to the point where no one is welcoming some of our newest users.

Same, my activity has dropped a lot lately (though the increased focus on schoolwork has been helping noticeably xD). I plan to integrate VR into my daily schedule more regularly again.

Like Spirit said, this isn't all that simple. Victory Road gets numerous new members each month, and sometimes it just isn't possible to send a personalized message to all of them, especially with time constraints and other responsibilities. To add to what Cat said, though, and partly in response to JC, Victory Road's staff members are actually quite "friendly", as they interact with the community quite frequently. If anything, this makes moderation a little more difficult, since we're so open with all the usual members anyway (in my opinion, at least). Digressing aside, all new members are welcomed in the beginning of the newsletter (which should begin publishing again in the near future), and while not quite "personal", it is an attempt to increase awareness of new members.

Wow, I've noticed that my post has quite a bit of criticism.
Let me just say-- What I did NOT want by what I said was a bunch of staff members saying "Hi! Welcome to VR!", because that kind of generic greeting is exactly what I got from an administrator of a different forum I tried joining awhile back. Needless to say, I haven't even thought about looking at it.
Yeah, I did become to that forum one of those people that VR now has a lot of-- an Unown.
I understand that there are a lot of new people to handle, but there isn't just one staff member! And you say that it would be difficult to say hello to everyone, but I've yet to see that sort of message come from any staff member except one: JC! Yeah, he sent me a VM explaining something to me on my first day here that was actually relevant.
What I'm trying to say is that the staff could make more of an effort to make new members feel welcome, but forgive me if I'm making any inaccurate judgments. I just think the first hour someone jumps onto a forum is the most important, or else they feel like the forum is just to big for them to get noticed.

Wall of text yay...?

Aw, FreezeWarp left? Oh well, I hope he does well where ever he goes. As for us, hopefully we'll get other good programmers running this site in place of him.

I don't you would like all of us sending you a PM explaining everything in the forums over and over again. It would seem dull, wouldn't it? It doesn't seem that the staff are not being considerate with the new members, as we often send them a welcoming message, and yes, we don't have time to send PMs all the time. It is exhausting, time consuming, and we already have tons of PMs to deal with every day.

But in terms of your suggestion to send a PM to any new member, I think and I hope Cat sees this post, we can easily make Victini Bot carries such a duty, but setting a standard message which can be sent to any joining member. This message can include a very welcoming notice, along with the rules and people to contact if they are having any trouble. Certain links of the projects of VR can also be included.

Not once did I see he said "PM" because a "message" could be anywhere on a message board such as VR, may it be PM, VM, Thread/Post, anyways, Victini Bot is all fine though to send a message like that. but here's the kicker, who wants to look at the first PM from a bot, I wouldn't, I just delete it more or less.

the thing is, some sort of message is fine, but WE have enough staff to compensate, it's not like your the only staff member on VR. because you see it as a big job, you should also see that if you get exhausted have another staff member take over.

What I'm saying is, I would do it for the enjoyment of new members, and I'm not even staff anymore... in another words, stop being selfish and ask other staff to help you or do shifts on making members feeling welcomed, VR will always be a community that has 100+ members, if members don't feel welcomed...

There is nothing selfish in what I am saying, and the daily routine I described is the same to most staff. What is strange is that none of the new members have complained about not being welcomed enough, while it is the older members complaining for some reason. Furthermore, the way both of you said it, claiming that you need "friendlier" members like you is rather insulting. It is like saying that the current staff are not friendly nor close, but strict and selfish, which is totally not true.

Funny story. since my unbanning I've been insulted and pushed around, for what? IDK about VR, and you guys have been not giving me a chance to prove myself, so yeah, I meant to insult you, rather then saying "Oh yeah, I like being pushed around, and what not."

Well, before this escalates any further, we don't take "shifts" welcoming new members, JC, and you're aware of that. We welcome as many as we're able to. Delegating the task as a responsibility would make it too obligatory and monotonous, and so it'd become even more emotionless and robotic than it may apparently already seem. Granted, I'm all for being more welcoming, and I'm sure everyone else is as well. It's just not seen as being as much of a must as something which we do simply for the kindness of the gesture.

On a side note, asserting your opinions is fine (hence the ability to discuss things in threads and what not), but I wouldn't say anyone here views you as a pushover. I personally hold your opinion in fairly high regard, having known you for a decent amount of time now. By all means, you can "prove yourself" if you feel like it, though there is a difference between insults and criticism. I'll cut the rant short here to avoid sounding overbearing, I suppose.

Aside form what Aura said, if this is your main problem, not feeling motivated around here, then you should discuss it openly and state your opinion about that matter, rather than belying your intentions by saying that we are not welcoming enough to new members as an excuse. Furthermore, if you feel insulted, then go and complain to those whom you think are insulting you, instead of directing your complaints at me, despite the fact that I rarely interact with you in the first place...

Original request: A more friendly approach to new members.
Subsequent arguments: Exhaustive, time-consuming, impractical (and thread taking a slightly negative approach).
My reaction: Seriously?

I don't understand why the hell the people above me are making a big deal out of nothing. The suggestion is simply meant to make new members interested in the forums a bit more, and even though it wasn't expressed in the best possible way, I do see a point behind it. The thing we need over here is a compromise solution; something that will take ideas/arguments from both ends and satisfy everyone. How about this?

Sending personalized PMs to each and every member might be a little difficult, so perhaps we could create a template which can be slightly edited in order to make members feel more welcome. I'm sure a copy-paste with few changes here and there won't take a lot of time. However, with that in mind, I'm still not entirely convinced of the idea, since it can be considered a repeat of the introduction thread. Nevertheless, I don't see the harm in trying out a minor suggestion like this.

Even though I never saw a whole lot of insulting directed at you in the staff board, I must say I never really interacted with you until you got unbanned. So you're just downgrading yourself although other people, including myself, don't.

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Now, on a different note, I REALLY believe tournaments should be resumed ASAP. Remember the golden days when we used to have an influx of new members every time we started a tournament? Yeah, we could really use one of these right now. A new theme, perhaps to coincide with Halloween/Christmas, wouldn't hurt either, and we definitely need to restore interest in once-active parts of the forums (mainly the VRGL for me, which I apologize for neglecting due to school burdens). To be honest, we're missing few (new) things/ideas to kick-start the activity on VR, but for the most part, the staff members primarily and the normal members in general have to utilize the numerous projects and sections which we already have.

Please take the argument portion to private message.

I think we're missing out on what it means to feel welcome. The feeling of being welcome, the sense of belonging, is achieved through communicating with friendly people that treat you with respect... continually. Not just when you enter for the first time. Not just through an unconditional "Welcome to X I hope you enjoy it here." The newcomer has to witness sincerity, consideration, and appreciation every which way they look. And it shouldn't just be directed at them, it should be present between others. The assurance we aim to provide can be nullified by fights happening around the corner. A new member can decide the place isn't for them just by lurking and seeing how people treat each other.

We can welcome members all we want in their intro threads, VMs, or PMs, but the welcome factor we suggest in such messages truly manifests only through our behavior in every part of the forum (and chat) to every member.

I am trying to press the like button more than once, but it will not let me. D:
PRS just won the internet, people. Seriously, someone needs to inscribe that in a gold plaque.

As far as the staff goes with the reform, I think they should be chosen based on what PRS just said: sincerity, consideration, and appreciation, along with presentability, respectability, and amiability.

When I really think about how much change might come out of this reformation, I get a little scared and a little excited! Best of luck to the people reforming the site!

Something I have in mind: why don't we utilize the arcade games in a proper way? I am not sure how we can fulfill such a suggestion, but focusing on the arcade for a change can be a little bit helpful.

Frankly, I've never really thought about the arcade much or even used it, but I must admit that it does make a nice distraction when you're bored. That was another of those things that was Freeze's idea. Half the time I forget it's even there. However, I'll continue to support it as long as people do want it to still be up.

Well, as long as it's still being used, there's the incentive to keep it, huh?

Even though I'm on VR for a pretty short time, I think I'm also getting excited on this site reformation. I wonder what good could come out of this?

Or bad... Change isn't always good. Keep that in mind throughout this "reformation".

Well, let's just hope for the best. I'm sure that the staff knows what they are doing.

We'll know what exactly happens when the reformation is done, huh?

I know, you are right, but I have issues about BIG change, little progress change is fine.

We're reforming a Pokemon site here, not the Catholic Church. :p

Really, I see no need to worry. Worrying doesn't make it any better, either. Just be excited and happy about it. c:

Yeah, and the unknown is almost always fun when it comes to things like this! There's a reason why my favourite phrase is "Don't worry too much about everything!". Besides, I was also in a Pokémon forum that had a major revamp and while the first few days were quite... I was not getting used to it, but, hey, I'm fine now, and I'm also enjoying the expanded functionality. So I think it'll be the same for Victory Road. Right?

Also, what's this about a staff reform?

He means that some members might get promoted, while some might get demoted.

Hmm... Even though I'm here for less than a week, I think I'm still intrigued by it. This staff reform, I mean. I do believe that there's a reason for everything, no? Oh, and thanks for clarifying that.

Hmm...interesting. We've been through site reformation like this before, and sometimes, that came out especially chaotic. Especially when we were switching servers, it took a good 2 weeks before the errors stopped popping up. I'm guessing this change isn't as totally drastic, so I'm hoping for lack of the server being annoying and causing us all to wait 6 hours for the site to come back on.

As for staff reformation, that should be pretty interesting. And I'm also eagerly anticipating VRAC, I wonder how that will function.

I think the VRAC is also part of the site reformation...

I'm willing to bet that the reformation will go as smooth as possible, as long as everything is handled properly. This isn't a server switch or forum software upgrade, so it should be smoother.

Just to let you know, we have associated VRAC with a few things that would make sense...
Chat (but has been proven untrue for that.)
Arcade (But Cat said he actually forgot we had one.)
Adoptables (one of the most possible with the crash of it and the leave of Freeze.)
Animal Crossing (But so many people said that it got not funny the second time.)
Accounts
Art.
Basically anything you slap before center.

Well, at least it's a great way to get some creative minds running.

Hmm... I wonder when this reformation will start?

If I am not mistaken, it should be taking a month or two.

Do you think it'll be done by the end of the year, just in time for the new year?

Cat is the one who is more capable of answering such question, but I certainly do hope so.

And maybe then we'll also be able to give the site reformation a fitting name for the new year!

Nothing's being done right now, right?

You surely are an inquisitive person. :P

Right now, the progress is minimal (at least on a staff-wide scale). However, I do believe that when holidays start to kick in, we will begin working to improve all the sections of the forums. Personally, I already have prepared 85% of the promised changes to the Victory Road Gym League. I'm hoping that these will be refreshing enough for all members to enjoy, but one particular member who's helping me out still needs to finalize something I asked him to do. When that's done, I'll introduce the new system at the most appropriate time, so you can expect something to pop up soon.

I seem to ask a lot of things. Huh.

I think all this work might start after a few more weeks. Or something close to it.

What's this new system you're talking about? I'm interested.

VRAC, VRIM Desktop, and Mario Minus World (name now tentative) are under development.

I know about the first two, but Mario Minus World? Oh my... Well, it's something that I didn't really expect here in VR! Is it separate from VR itself?

Mario Minus World was my first website, which I intended to be a site that was going to host lots of game-related material but didn't really meet my expectations. With increased knowledge of databases, it's a bit more doable now. Yes, it is separate from VR.

I think I have never really heard of it until now. Do you think you are going to link it to here (and vice versa)? That said, what does MMW hold?

Yes, most definitely, it will be part of the VR Network, which I will try to emphasize more in the future. (Many people don't even know we have an oekaki, which I mostly programmed myself beyond the applets.) I may even use the VR account table to setup a user-based submission system to add (moderated, of course) content.

Do you think you could find a way to... you know, promote everything that you have in a better way? Maybe on the homepage of Floatzel.Net? Just having them linked at the top or the left as a bunch of easy-to-miss text isn't going to do wonders, I think.

That is not a bad idea. We're still working on a hub/portal thing.

I wonder what that hub/portal would look like. It must be a WIP right now.

The portal still is not even designed. VRAC and MMW already have a layout (not necessarily a color scheme yet) and are somewhat functional. MMW reads from the database and generates game lists based on the currently selected console. I cannot give details on VRAC yet. VRIM Desktop has a pseudo-layout together (with little functional code), but it may be scrapped. The new version is still all terminal-based. Maybe if I get bored, I'll release a terminal version for those feeling nostalgic.

I think it would take months before they are usable, then.

The database... I think it's been implemented since who knows how long...

I'm not sure whether I'm a terminal person myself.

We should make me a mod lol
That complete lie aside, I would love to see Mario Minus World be re-opened again, I've heard some things about it. And I'm dying to hear what VRAC would be like, all sounds pretty good.

I do believe that I'll be seeing all of them by the end of the year. Right?