The Xbox One

[Quadcentruo]

Originally Posted by Cat333Pokémon

I am going to leave this article here without stating my opinion:
http://gizmodo.com/the-xbox-one-just...ault-514411905

To summarize: Without DRM policies, you can't share digital titles and gaming technology will remain at a standstill.

To criticize the article:

Here was the simple vision of the Xbox One, selling and reselling games:
Every game you bought, physical or digital, would be tied to your account. This would eliminate current-gen problems like buying a disc, and then being unable to store it or download it from the cloud.

"Because I keep losing my disc cases and I don't have anywhere I can put my games if I do have the cases."

Because every single game, physical or digital, would be tied to an account, publishers could create a hub to sell and resell the games digitally. Let's refer to these as "licenses" from here, even though it's a loaded term.

So basically, publishers can be even greedier and make money off used games as well as new ones, removing resale game stores, like GameStop, from ever getting in the way again, thus causing potentially thousands of jobs to be lost from GameStop and other various stores going under.

Because reselling games would now work through a hub, publishers could make money on resold games.

See above.

Here is how this makes sense for YOU: New games could then be cheaper. Why? Publishers KNOW that they will not make money on resold games, so they charge more to you, the first buyer. You are paying for others' rights to use your game in the future. If the old system had gone into place, you would likely have seen game prices drop. Or, at the very least, it could have staved off price increases.

Bold text: Explain to me the logic behind digital-only titles, like PC games, that have a starting base price of $60. You can't even sell those games to a used-game shop, so why make it so expensive?
Underlined text: If by "old system" you mean "DRM policies," explain to me and everyone else why that would lower prices or not cause a price increase. Because publishers can now make money off used games, or rather, licenses? If you lower prices on games, you also lower your profit because you believe that the money you'll make from used licenses will fill in the gap that the lowered new prices have left. But have you considered this - what is stopping publishers from charging full price for used licenses? What if there is a lower amount of people selling their games than anticipated? If prices don't drop, that would also mean used licenses have a potential to not drop either, meaning a new or used license for a game would cost $60. If less people sell their licenses, that would mean a loss in potential profit, causing publishers to get angry at Microsoft. One of the perks of buying a used game is that it's cheaper than a new version.

You also would have started getting a better return on your "used" games—because a license does not have to be resold at a diminished rate.

Have you never sold a game to GameStop? They gave you the short-straw on the sale to make a giant profit. What's to say that publishers won't do the same thing? i.e., You sell a game's license, the publisher gives you a measly $5 for it, then the publisher turns around and sells it for $60 again.

How do you know that this would have been the case? Because that's exactly what happens on Steam. But wait!, you shout. Steam is CHEAP cheap, and it has crazy sales. We love Steam! Micro$oft is nothing like that. Well, no, it isn't now, but Steam was once $team, too. It was not always popular, and its licensing model was once heavily maligned. Given time, though, it's now the only way almost every PC gamer wants to play games.

Mister Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw of Zero Punctuation once said something that has stuck with me ever since I've heard it. The phrase goes along the lines of "'It gets better later' is never a good excuse."
Also, regarding PC gaming and Steam - It's either use Steam, EA's version of Steam which is significantly worse - Origin - or go hunting for games that decided they're too cool for online stores. You won't find much. It's less of a "want to" and more of a "has to" if they want something mildly decent.
Also also, Valve gives discounts so often because they know how to make consumers happy. Microsoft would never lower prices like crazy just because they are doing well; in fact, they'd probably see that as an opportunity to make more money off games.
Also cubed, what do you mean by "its licensing model was once heavily maligned"? Are you trying to say that Steam lets you share games digitally? As far as I know, if I send the files of a game I own to a friend of mine, he'd be considered a pirate and I'd be considered an illegal distributor. You need to elaborate a bit more on that statement, Mr.Writer.

Sharing games would have worked either by activating your Live account on someone else's Xbox One, or by including them in your 10-person share plan, which would not have been limited to "family.". Details on that had been scarse, but even the strictest limitations (one other person playing any of the shared games from your account) would have been a HUGE improvement over the none that we have now. We don't get that now.

There's a reason why sharing digital copies is faulty and that's because it's too easy to manipulate. Or at least, it is on PC. In a console case, however, it's an invitation for people to not buy games. Think about it this way - why would I buy a game if my friend has it on his Xbox One and I can just ask him to let me use it on my account? It would go from "sharing games with a friend" to "giving my friend a copied version of my game for free." Even with a limitation on how many people you can share with, it would be nearly on the same level as piracy.

The 24-hour check-in would have been necessary for the X1's store, which it is not for Steam, because the physical product (game discs) would still be available. This check-in, literally bytes of data exchanged, would confirm that the games installed were not gaming the system in a convoluted install-here-and-then-go-offline-and-I'll-go-home-and-check-in-and-go-offline-too-and-we'll-both-use-the-game methods.

Wait, run by that me again? Removing the once-a-day system means people can install games on one system, bring the game home to their system that has it installed, and both systems can play it simultaneously? Didn't the Xbox 360 require you to have the disc in the system, regardless of whether or not it was installed to your hard drive? Even if it was download-only, installing to both systems, regardless if it were the new system or the old system of online connection, I pointed out that you could essentially do the same thing with the policy you fell in love with, Mr.Writer. With what you explained and with how it is now, you can still give away one free copy of a game to your friend. But you seemed to have forgotten one thing - discs. If Microsoft continues to show the brain levels that they have been, they'll implement the same system the Xbox 360 used where you have to have the disc in the system to play it, regardless of whether or not it's download to the hard drive. Even if there aren't discs, they could simply implement the Xbox 360 system again - you can download the game to a friend's hard drive, but the friend can only play it on your account. If this were the case, you'd have to be online to do it anyway otherwise the game refuses to run.
There is just so much wrong in that statement that I would have to create an entire thread explaining what is wrong with it.

In conclusion, Mr.Writer, it seems you are comparing the Xbox One to Steam. Yes, you can download games from an online store with both, but you can't share games on Steam and you most likely will never be able to. You also seem to be looking at what benefits were lost with removing the DRM policies and not what drawbacks were lost; the biggest drawback you just-so happen to forget was the fact that if you are not connected to the internet you lose access to all of your games, which is one of the biggest detours for people in areas with shaky internet connections.

Just because a new system allows new ways to share games that would "advance" gaming technology it doesn't mean that it is a good thing. You have to consider what is needed for that system to work and consider if it's worth it in the long run. Having the once-a-day check would detour people from buying it, especially if they have unstable internet, and having the DRM policies in place would also detour people because they don't want to sit in front of their TV while they fill in the necessary codes and waiting for it to install just to play a new game. This would lower accessibility and as a result, lower sales meaning lower profits and potentially a loss in money.

[GreenMan]

Originally Posted by Quadcentruo

To summarize: Without DRM policies, you can't share digital titles and gaming technology will remain at a standstill.

In conclusion, Mr.Writer, it seems you are comparing the Xbox One to Steam. Yes, you can download games from an online store with both, but you can't share games on Steam and you most likely will never be able to. You also seem to be looking at what benefits were lost with removing the DRM policies and not what drawbacks were lost; the biggest drawback you just-so happen to forget was the fact that if you are not connected to the internet you lose access to all of your games, which is one of the biggest detours for people in areas with shaky internet connections.

Speaking on the having to download games to play them again bit. I have about 200 GB of games I've gotten, downloaded, and play here and there from steam on my computer. So when my hard drive started to show it had corrupted bad sectors I had two choices. Figure out how to back everything up on a secondary drive (which will like remain my self proclaimed steam drive, for space and not having to bloody download it all again) or I could go and download my games again. TF2, Left 4 Dead 1& 2, along with the many indie titles. Which for the big games it locks my PC out for 8 hours, which means any games on steam I can't do anything. Similar thing happens when the Xbox 360 game is updating.

The idea of doing the same for the Xbox One seems nuts, I want to get my game take off the plastic, open (and enjoy the smell), and play. I will wait for minor updates but after that I want to be good to go. No clue how fast the download speed from disk would be bout I doubt I could do the same, not to mention the hard drive fills up which means that you have to get a secondary one if your collection starts to expand. (Fortunately you can get a cheap external hard drive and your good (one thing PS4 doesn't do)

"The new PC games need an HDD space of around 7-8 gigs. That's the same amount of space most 360 games use as well." found when I went to look at game size. So average game collection is what 10-50 games depending on size. Each one eating up we will say 8 GB which means you need an 80 GB hard drive to store all them with a collection of 10 or 400 GB if you happen to have 50 Xbox One games (no clue if that many will be release but roll with it). Now lets say that hard drive crashes. You have to reinstall and replace that hard drive. Since they are all digital downloads that's more time with it sitting there waiting to be used because you have to re-download them to your console.

Seeing the problem yet?

Digitally being able to share your games is cool. Nice idea, problem is gonna be hackers who figure a way around that share with only one person clause.

As was said: All because it's more advanced doesn't make it better.

[PHANTOMxTRAINER]

Are there any tl;drs? I'm too lazy to read all of that. But anyways, I've been hearing this rumor of free XBL for the Xbox One. Is this true, or have you guys heard of it too?

[Cat333Pokémon]

The tl;dr is "Xbox 180, but the damage has been done."

[PHANTOMxTRAINER]

Ah 180 metaphorically, not literally lol. At first I thought that was the new name change, but I see now..

[Cyrus]

So uhhh, this happened apparently.

It seems like to me he basically got fired from all the scrutiny.

[DashArmy]

xbox go home

To be completely honest, the Xbox One, especially at E3, was a huge PR disaster for Microsoft. With demos running on HP pc's, live not being supported in many other countries at launch, and the (giggle) Battlefield 4 sound hiccup, I really can't support them anymore. Halo's been dried out at this point and I'm not getting an Xbox One. It's just not a system seller.

They might have changed their stance on used games, but that still leaves the price point and accompanying Kinect 2.0.

Meanwhile..

[TurtwigX]

It seems I'm the only one left that still believes in the Xbox One having potential. Halo is the only FPS I enjoy and Kinect is definitely my favorite motion controller. With the console requiring it I'm pretty sure that'll mean stronger Kinect support. I especially liked that Max platformer game, one of my favorites shown at E3 week.

Even though their turnaround was unexpected and makes it look more like a 360+, I'm gonna wait until it comes out to see what it looks like.

[Cat333Pokémon]

Oh, I believe the Xbox One has potential again. I just have no interest in buying One. It'll probably be like the Xbox 360 and take a few years before I have a reason to pick One up.

[Cat333Pokémon]

The Xbox team must be having a ton of fun digging themselves back into that hole:
Using PlayStation footage in a trailer
Releasing the day one patch three weeks early
Losing major money on Xbox

[Wolfbane5001]

Originally Posted by Cat333Pokémon

The Xbox team must be having a ton of fun digging themselves back into that hole:
Using PlayStation footage in a trailer
Releasing the day one patch three weeks early
Losing major money on Xbox

Maybe people are also starting to realize that the Xbox is just a computer and Steam can fill the gaming gaps... with free online multiplayer, which the Xbox doesn't have.

[Music]

I don't think there would be so many people opposed to Xbox One if Microsoft did better when it came to marketing. Sony are great at hiding things, meanwhile Microsoft just comes out and says everything in way too much detail.

[Magmaster12]

I found an interesting blog post on some musings on Microsoft's strategy of the Xbox One.

He's not completely biased because he does mention people have been moving away from Sony.

I think I'll just rely on computer and an HDMI cable for gaming this generation.

[Cat333Pokémon]

The best news in that article was this part:

Ballmer has thankfully announced in the last few weeks that he will be stepping down as CEO, probably to the relieved sighs of shareholders everywhere.

About dang time. Gates really should return to being the head of Microsoft. Even if he doesn't, the new CEO better be a lot more consumer friendly.

[Cat333Pokémon]

And Sony continues to take advantage of Microsoft's gaffes.

Originally Posted by Cat333Pokémon

Releasing the day one patch three weeks early

The unboxing video (which is back online now) at the above link was removed because of an alleged copyright claim from Microsoft.

Sony's response:

[Shade]

During my latest trip to the local Wal-Mart, I noticed that almost all the gaming ads are geared towards the Xbox One, with little to none geared towards the PS4. I'm assuming that the big W is being paid by Microsoft to do this, but again, just an assumption on my part.

[Wolfbane5001]

Originally Posted by Shade

During my latest trip to the local Wal-Mart, I noticed that almost all the gaming ads are geared towards the Xbox One, with little to none geared towards the PS4. I'm assuming that the big W is being paid by Microsoft to do this, but again, just an assumption on my part.

While Nintendo just sits back and laughs at them both.

[Cat333Pokémon]

You've got to be kidding me. The Xbox One is ALSO having tons of issues like the PlayStation 4. Who the heck manufactured these things?!

http://www.idigitaltimes.com/article...ve-failure.htm
http://www.gamepur.com/news/12853-re...sed-proof.html

The next generation is starting out quite well.

[Dragonite]

So by the sound of it the 8th generation will be known as the "Generation of Failures?"

[Cat333Pokémon]

I'm sure this stuff will get sorted out within a few months. Last generation had a lot of problems with both Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3, so maybe it's "normal" for both companies to continue having trouble? *shrugs*

[PureAurorae]

I am definatley sticking with the 360 right now. Although games such as Forza are catching my eye, I would say in general that I will wait for at least a year because my friends are not planning on buying next gen yet.

[PHANTOMxTRAINER]

*Sigh* even with my mom's microsoft discount: $470 dollars... I think I might actually have to abandon xbox on this one. absolutely no pun intended.

[Cat333Pokémon]

Today's Darwin Award goes to this guy:
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/man.../1100-6416572/