JUNE TOURNAMENT INFORMATION/DISCUSSION

[Ditto616]

Hello folks, it's me again. During the month of June, the tournament will be held using the Pokémon Video Game Championship rules. The link to the rules is found here: http://www.pokemonvgc.com/en/regulations.php

There will be a few things changed though.

• Any version of the following is allowed: Pokémon Diamond, Pearl, Platinum, HeartGold, SoulSilver.
• There will be no Junior or Senior division brackets. Just one big set of brackets.

I think that's really it though. Post any ideas, dismays or comments, just THIS ISN'T FOR SIGN UP. IF THAT IS THE ONLY THING YOU SAY IN YOUR POST, IT WILL BE DELETED.
Ningamer posted these, so I'll put them here.

Pokémon that may not be used    

You can use any Pokemon aside from:

151 - Mew

251 - Celebi

385 - Jirachi

386 - Deoxys

489 - Phione

490 - Manaphy

491 - Darkrai

492 - Shaymin

493 - Arceus

There can only be TWO of these on a team    

You can use up to two of these in your team:

150 - Mewtwo

249 - Lugia

250 - Ho-Oh

382 - Kyogre

383 - Groudon

384 - Rayquaza

483 - Dialga

484 - Palkia

487 - Giratina

With that said, now it is time to discuss!

[Sunny]

Wowowow~!
So like, we can use an uber in this? =p

[Quadcentruo]

Originally Posted by Sunny

Wowowow~!
So like, we can use an uber in this? =p

*Nods head*
Broken, right?
It might as well be an Uber's tournament.

[Ditto616]

This is meant to recreate somewhat of a regional if we all competed against each other. It would be, if possible, the best choice for a battle representative for Victory Road, you could say.

[aragornbird]

Oh wow, awesome. I can't go to any of the VGC sites because they're too far away, but I would love a VGC style tournament!

And Quad, you can only use two Ubers on your team.

Anyways, it sounds great. I'm all for it.

[Magmaster12]

So I can use my Garchomp?

[aragornbird]

Well yeah, as long as it isn't an Event Legendary, it can be used.

[Quadcentruo]

Originally Posted by aragornbird

And Quad, you can only use two Ubers on your team.

Oh thanks for clearing that up for me.
Like it matters for me though, I wont be able to join.

[SK]

Sounds fun, I can use a few Ubers.

[kakashidragon]

Cant garchomp be used in any doubles? Like normal battles, i know he cant be used in single battles but uber, so can he be used in any OU double battles? Also maybe i will join this just to see what this WC2010 rules are like.

[Ningamer]

I know it's not in the rules, but can we ban Wynaut/Wobbufett?

[Luxray13579]

Good thing its the VGC rules, I have a perfect team all ready. I actually think we should copy all the rules to be the exact same (except the "Only HG/SS" rule).

[aragornbird]

Originally Posted by kakashidragon

Cant garchomp be used in any doubles? Like normal battles, i know he cant be used in single battles but uber, so can he be used in any OU double battles? Also maybe i will join this just to see what this WC2010 rules are like.

This isn't OU double battle, this is Uber double battle. The rules are all there in the link.

Originally Posted by Ningamer

I know it's not in the rules, but can we ban Wynaut/Wobbufett?

Why? Wynaut/Wobbuffet are pretty much useless in doubles. Your opponent will just target your partner, leaving Wobbuffet as dead weight.

[Ningamer]

Fair enough...
I'm glad there's finally a NORMAL tournament where I can use all my good Pokemon. I'm a newbie to competitive battling, and I couldn't train a team of Gen IV Pokemon that fast.

[kakashidragon]

i know this isnt OU, I just wanted to ask if garchomp can be used in standard doubles battles outside of this tournament. (even tho this isnt the place to ask)

[Sunny]

Originally Posted by kakashidragon

i know this isnt OU, I just wanted to ask if garchomp can be used in standard doubles battles outside of this tournament. (even tho this isnt the place to ask)

Yea, it ain't the place to ask it.
But no. Uber is uber, double battle or not. If your opponent lets you sure, but in tourneys garchomp is banned. I'd think he'd be even more of a threat in a double battle, since he boast STAB earthquake.

[TurtwigX]

Hmm, seems good.
Would love to join with my Cute Little Giwatina~.
Still, anything allowed, and only 2 Ubers? What about Wobbufet and Wynaut? They're like demons.

[Ditto616]

Well, it's not any two ubers. It's any two legendaries on the list. If you want to get technical, you could have 5 ubers, but that's cheap and stupid. (2 from the list, Garchomp, Wobbuffet, and Wynaut)

[Quadcentruo]

Originally Posted by TurtwigX

Hmm, seems good.
Would love to join with my Cute Little Giwatina~.
Still, anything allowed, and only 2 Ubers? What about Wobbufet and Wynaut? They're like demons.

Anything allowed = yes to Wobbufet and Wynaut.

[TurtwigX]

Originally Posted by Ditto616

Well, it's not any two ubers. It's any two legendaries on the list. If you want to get technical, you could have 5 ubers, but that's cheap and stupid. (2 from the list, Garchomp, Wobbuffet, and Wynaut)

Eh, I don't us Ubers much. They're actually quite hindering to train, since they're banned a whole lot.
The only one I trained is my Giratina, it helped me beat the league. He's special to me~!

Originally Posted by Quadcentruo

Anything allowed = yes to Wobbufet and Wynaut.

Oh ma gawd. I am now preparing to lose fruitfully. *Braces himself*

[Alakazamaster]

Originally Posted by TurtwigX

Oh ma gawd. I am now preparing to lose fruitfully. *Braces himself*

Relax, Wobbuffet and Wynaut are horrendously bad in Double Battles.

[TurtwigX]

Originally Posted by Alakazamaster

Relax, Wobbuffet and Wynaut are horrendously bad in Double Battles.

Yaaay~!
Although, unfortunately for me I suck at Double Battles. I'm fail on a Leaf.

[Quadcentruo]

Originally Posted by Alakazamaster

Relax, Wobbuffet and Wynaut are horrendously bad in Double Battles.

To me, Wobbuffet and Wynaut are just bad in general.
Why? Well, here are some calculations (thanks to smogon damage calculator)

If a swords-dancing Weavile is sent out against Wobbuffet (to, lets say, revenge kill it), what could happen is this:
-Night slash by itself will do 61.1% damage (330 HP) to 72.2% damage (390 HP).
-If Night slash is critical, then it will do 122.6% damage (662 HP) to 144.4% damage (780 HP).
-If a SMART person is using this Weavile set, then that person will set up and swords dance. Thus, the damage will go to this, 121.1% damage (654 HP) to 142.6% damage (770 HP).

Wynaut will go down in a single night slash that isn't powered up, so there is no reason to post calculations.

Even if Wobbuffet uses Encore to make it so Weavile is stuck using Swords dance, that would only be hurting its cause. It would be forced to switch out or faint after Weavile's encore is finished.

This is some reasons why Wobbuffet shouldn't be an Uber, regardless of it being able to counter everything. There are plenty of things that can take Wobbuffet down in a single shot due to its poor defense and Special Defense.

So, my recommendation is:
DON'T USE WOBBUFFET OR WYNAUT!!!

[Alakazamaster]

Originally Posted by Quadcentruo

To me, Wobbuffet and Wynaut are just bad in general.
Why? Well, here are some calculations (thanks to smogon damage calculator)

If a swords-dancing Weavile is sent out against Wobbuffet (to, lets say, revenge kill it), what could happen is this:
-Night slash by itself will do 61.1% damage (330 HP) to 72.2% damage (390 HP).
-If Night slash is critical, then it will do 122.6% damage (662 HP) to 144.4% damage (780 HP).
-If a SMART person is using this Weavile set, then that person will set up and swords dance. Thus, the damage will go to this, 121.1% damage (654 HP) to 142.6% damage (770 HP).

Wynaut will go down in a single night slash that isn't powered up, so there is no reason to post calculations.

Even if Wobbuffet uses Encore to make it so Weavile is stuck using Swords dance, that would only be hurting its cause. It would be forced to switch out or faint after Weavile's encore is finished.

This is some reasons why Wobbuffet shouldn't be an Uber, regardless of it being able to counter everything. There are plenty of things that can take Wobbuffet down in a single shot due to its poor defense and Special Defense.

So, my recommendation is:
DON'T USE WOBBUFFET OR WYNAUT!!!

Wobbuffet is considered Ubers just because it is so hard to take down. If Weavile Night Slahses it, Counter OHKOs for a kill. And if it DOES Swords Dance, Encore handles that. So what if Wobbuffet has to switch out? That's what it is made to do. Encore something so you can bring in somethink else that can set up, like Calm Mind Kyogre. Thus, the Encore'd Pokemon has to switch out (or at least should, if they are not morons.) And even if Wobbuffet does not have stellar defenses, it has amazing HP which lets it survive just about anything and score at least one kill back. Trust me, Ubers is it's place for single battles.

[Quadcentruo]

Originally Posted by Alakazamaster

Wobbuffet is considered Ubers just because it is so hard to take down. If Weavile Night Slahses it, Counter OHKOs for a kill. And if it DOES Swords Dance, Encore handles that. So what if Wobbuffet has to switch out? That's what it is made to do. Encore something so you can bring in somethink else that can set up, like Calm Mind Kyogre. Thus, the Encore'd Pokemon has to switch out (or at least should, if they are not morons.) And even if Wobbuffet does not have stellar defenses, it has amazing HP which lets it survive just about anything and score at least one kill back. Trust me, Ubers is it's place for single battles.

So basically, what your saying is, Wobbuffet only has to worry about critical hits? (Almost said baton passers... shadow tag, duh.)

[Alakazamaster]

Originally Posted by Quadcentruo

So basically, what your saying is, Wobbuffet only has to worry about critical hits? (Almost said baton passers... shadow tag, duh.)

Like most Pokemon, yes.

[kakashidragon]

so if i go rain dance style for this, shednija beasts in double battles. Well at least on youtube during the WC09 i watched them beast with him. They teamed him up with kyogre and 2 others.

[Quadcentruo]

It's because Shed- WAIT WHAT?!
Shedinja really? You sure it wasn't Ninjask?
Because I know Ninjask works really well in Ubers because of it being a Bug type... same with Scizor.

[Alakazamaster]

Originally Posted by Quadcentruo

It's because Shed- WAIT WHAT?!
Shedinja really? You sure it wasn't Ninjask?
Because I know Ninjask works really well in Ubers because of it being a Bug type... same with Scizor.

He means Shedinja. Shedinja resists just enough stuff that makes him super useful. Kyogre and Ludicolo cant do anything to him, for example.

[Quadcentruo]

And does that mean people don't use stealth rock in this kinda stuff?
Because there is a lot of stuff that can beat Shedinja.

Check smogon.com, they have a complete list of things that can take it down near the bottom of the list on its page.

But when you think about it, if Shedinja isn't taken out by stage hazards, it could be awesome in doubles.
Example: Having your other Pokemon paralyze Shedinja, causing it to not get taken out by burn or poison. (Hint, hint, nudge, nudge)

[Alakazamaster]

Originally Posted by Quadcentruo

And does that mean people don't use stealth rock in this kinda stuff?
Because there is a lot of stuff that can beat Shedinja.

Check smogon.com, they have a complete list of things that can take it down near the bottom of the list on its page.

But when you think about it, if Shedinja isn't taken out by stage hazards, it could be awesome in doubles.
Example: Having your other Pokemon paralyze Shedinja, causing it to not get taken out by burn or poison. (Hint, hint, nudge, nudge)

No one uses entry hazard in VGC Battles, because each team only has 4 Pokemon, and two of them are out to begin with. There is no use in wasting a moveslot to hit two Pokemon for minor damage. As such, Shedinja is able to flourish. Plus, the Kyogre and Ludicolo partnership is immensely popular, so Shedinja works as a fantastic counter. Plus, he can use Sunny Day to ruin the rain. Give him a Focus Sash and he is guaranteed to stick around long enough to do something productive.

[kakashidragon]

if i join this i might use shednija

[omnizard]

so do you mean no pokemon from d/p/pt/hg/ss
or something else?

[Ningamer]

Originally Posted by omnizard

so do you mean no pokemon from d/p/pt/hg/ss
or something else?

You can use any Pokemon aside from:
151 - Mew
251 - Celebi
385 - Jirachi
386 - Deoxys
489 - Phione
490 - Manaphy
491 - Darkrai
492 - Shaymin
493 - Arceus

You can use up to two of these in your team:
150 - Mewtwo
249 - Lugia
250 - Ho-Oh
382 - Kyogre
383 - Groudon
384 - Rayquaza
483 - Dialga
484 - Palkia
487 - Giratina

[Alakazamaster]

Originally Posted by Ningamer

You can use any Pokemon aside from:
151 - Mew
251 - Celebi
385 - Jirachi
386 - Deoxys
489 - Phione
490 - Manaphy
491 - Darkrai
492 - Shaymin
493 - Arceus

You can use up to two of these in your team:
150 - Mewtwo
249 - Lugia
250 - Ho-Oh
382 - Kyogre
383 - Groudon
384 - Rayquaza
483 - Dialga
484 - Palkia
487 - Giratina

Wow I like how you can use a Dialga and Kyogre but not one Celebi. Nevertheless, thanks for putting this list up.

[Ningamer]

Originally Posted by Alakazamaster

Wow I like how you can use a Dialga and Kyogre but not one Celebi. Nevertheless, thanks for putting this list up.

Yeah, these rules are ripped straight from the Pokémon Video Game Championships. They banned any Pokemon you get from events.

[Ditto616]

Thanks for compiling that list. I'll be ste--Taking them and putting them in the rules now, so I don't forget when I'm copying into the sign up thread.

[kakashidragon]

so when is this start? I forgot

[Ningamer]

Originally Posted by kakashidragon

so when is this start? I forgot

Sign-ups will start in a week or two, the actual tournament will be at the end of the month (Most likely 26th or 27th).

[Quadcentruo]

Originally Posted by Ningamer

They banned any Pokemon you get from events.

Which is funny because Phoine is absolutely terrible in general and you can get as many as you want I think.

[DashArmy]

Originally Posted by Ditto616

This is meant to recreate somewhat of a regional if we all competed against each other. It would be, if possible, the best choice for a battle representative for Victory Road, you could say.

Spoiler Alert:    

coughashcough

[Magmaster12]

Are you sure you want to disinclude the evasion clause?

[aragornbird]

It's not an official VGC rule, so it shouldn't be a rule here.

Besides, evasion is much harder to abuse in 2vs2 than it is in 1vs1.

[Ningamer]

Originally Posted by Quadcentruo

Which is funny because Phoine is absolutely terrible in general and you can get as many as you want I think.

As long as you have a Manaphy and a sex slave Ditto, then yes.

And how is it harder to abuse? Because you can have two Pokemon attacking the same one on the same turn, so you're twice(-ish) as likely to hit?

[Alakazamaster]

Originally Posted by Ningamer

And how is it harder to abuse? Because you can have two Pokemon attacking the same one on the same turn, so you're twice(-ish) as likely to hit?

Exactly. The Double Battle metagame is alot more air-tight, and every move counts. Thus, it would be not only harder, but also stupider to use Double Team, since you are both relying on luck and wasting a valuable turn.

[Sunny]

Hmmm
Follow me + bulky double teamer = HAXHAXHAXHAX

[Ningamer]

Originally Posted by Sunny

Follow me

Here's a tip for everyone: USE THIS MOVE.

[Sunny]

Follow me ain't as full proof as you think. :< I think the bulkiest user of it is clefable, and multy target moves render it uselesss.

[kakashidragon]

I got a good question for yas. what if someone uses smeargle and uses darkvoid? how does sleep clause work for it? Cause i just made a smeargle for double battles with this move and was planning to use it. Cause on youtube i watch some videos for the last years world championships and a smeargle uses darkvoid.

[Ningamer]

I don't believe there is a sleep clause in play.

[Ditto616]

The VGC rules do not enforce a sleep clause, so this tournament doesn't either.

[kakashidragon]

sweet no sleepclause then! You better be ready for this move then I might add it or not but im really not telling u.

[Blues]

Originally Posted by Ningamer

I don't believe there is a sleep clause in play.

*gets Pokemon with Insomnia*

o_o

[SokPwn2]

what is VGC?

[LiteTheIronMan]

Originally Posted by SokPwn2

what is VGC?

I retort to your comment not with a legitimate response, not with a sarcastic answer, but with a Strong Bad-ized other question/SBemail:

Strong Bad Email Number 9001: Ghostwritten by LiteTheIronMan    

What is "knowledge/reading the intro paragraph to the topic/paying attention to detail/common sense/sense of deduction"? Because whatever it is, you don't seem to be applying it to this situation.

And because I have SOME sort of pity for you (y'know, since you're a foo' and all), I will honestly answer your question.

Video
Game
Championship

[SokPwn2]

oh, I see

[Lamp]

So when are the brackets being posted?

[LiteTheIronMan]

Originally Posted by Lamp

So when are the brackets being posted?

Well, we'll probably cut signups off tomorrow or Saturday, so once we do that we'll MS Paint our way to some really cool brackets!

...or we can use an online bracket formatter.

[Lamp]

Originally Posted by LiteTheIronMan

Well, we'll probably cut signups off tomorrow or Saturday, so once we do that we'll MS Paint our way to some really cool brackets!

...or we can use an online bracket formatter.

Ditto closed signups last night

[LiteTheIronMan]

Ah, didn't see that.

Well, if I find the time tomorrow I'll make the brackets. It'll be a little bit tricky to make a 32-person bracket since we haven't had a tourney as large as this in a while. If I don't post any tomorrow then can someone else (Ala or Ditto or a mod who'd like to help) make even brackets?

[Ningamer]

Hold on - Despite this being double battles with four Pokemon each, can we enter six and swap two of them between matches?

[LiteTheIronMan]

Originally Posted by Excerpt from VGC Rules

•Each player must enter 4-6 Pokémon on his or her Team Information Sheet. See the Ineligible and Restricted Pokémon lists below for more information on which Pokémon are eligible for the tournament.
•Each player must enter 0-6 held items on his or her Team Information Sheet.
•Players may only use Pokémon and held items listed on their Team Information Sheet during the tournament.
•The Pokémon and held items listed on a player's Team Information Sheet may not be changed once the player has registered for the event.
•Players may change which held item a Pokémon is using between matches so long as both the Pokémon and the held item are listed on the player's Team Information Sheet.

You can apparently enter 6 Pokemon and 6 items. However, you can only enter 4 Pokemon at a time in battle and you can only use those 6.

[kakashidragon]

so we have to list our team to you guys?

[Ningamer]

Originally Posted by kakashidragon

so we have to list our team to you guys?

No, no. Just use the same six Pokemon through the tournament (Keeping track of everyone is way too much work).

[arcader34]

just making sure. i did sign up cause wen i looked at the brackets my name wsn't on.

[LiteTheIronMan]

Originally Posted by arcader34

just making sure. i did sign up cause wen i looked at the brackets my name wsn't on.

The brackets posted aren't the full brackets. They should be disregarded.

Beyond that, your name isn't in the signup thread- you never signed up to begin with so the brackets show no discrepancies.

[Whatsmyname153]

Oh ummm what if we are a few minutes late for the battle tourny?

[LiteTheIronMan]

Originally Posted by Whatsmyname153

Oh ummm what if we are a few minutes late for the battle tourny?

I KNOW I've said this already. You can only allow yourself to be 15 minutes late. Beyond that, you're disqualified.

[Whatsmyname153]

Ok...I better set my clock then....

[arcader34]

ummm actually i did. if u look at the sign ups page 4 5th comment. i said

WOOHOO TIME FOR PWNAGE. hvn't played pokemon in over a year. P.S. wt's does a Pokémon obtained by Random Number Generator manipulation mean. so like wts a random number generator???

I'm sorry if I didn't make it clear but that was my sign up

[LiteTheIronMan]

Originally Posted by arcader34

ummm actually i did. if u look at the sign ups page 4 5th comment. i said

WOOHOO TIME FOR PWNAGE. hvn't played pokemon in over a year. P.S. wt's does a Pokémon obtained by Random Number Generator manipulation mean. so like wts a random number generator???

I'm sorry if I didn't make it clear but that was my sign up

That wasn't regarded as a signup, that was regarded as a question. You never stated you were signing up. Your post consisted of you asking how the random number generator works in Pokemon games.

[TheAppleFreak]

It's theoretically possible that I might not be able to make this tournament. Turns out I have a bike ride today, and I don't know when it'll end (I suspect around 2 PM EST, or 11 AM PST). If I can't make it at all, then feel free to disqualify me, but if not, then.... yeah. I have every intention on making this tournament.

[arcader34]

so can it be regarded as a sign up???

[Yoshi648]

^Obviously doesn't take a hint. We aren't allowing any more sign ups or replacements so stop asking.

[arcader34]

well that's messed

[Lamp]

So have the new brackets been formed yet?

[ALCHE]

Originally Posted by arcader34

well that's messed

You never formally signed up, that's it.

Originally Posted by Lamp

So have the new brackets been formed yet?

I think they will be formed few minutes before the tournament.

[expofever]

h iam expofever is this the vgc battle tournament

[LiteTheIronMan]

Originally Posted by Lamp

So have the new brackets been formed yet?

We'll get this taken care of once everyone participating arrives.

Originally Posted by expofever

h iam expofever is this the vgc battle tournament

...Are you or are you not literate?

[Lamp]

I think they will be formed few minutes before the tournament[/QUOTE]

So in about 2 hours?

[LiteTheIronMan]

Originally Posted by Lamp

I think they will be formed few minutes before the tournament

So in about 2 hours?[/QUOTE]

Well, what we were planning on doing was what Magmaster12 suggested in the brackets thread: Get everyone who signed up in the check-in thread, and then after that's done, form the brackets, taking all the no-shows into account.

[Lamp]

Originally Posted by LiteTheIronMan

So in about 2 hours?

Well, what we were planning on doing was what Magmaster12 suggested in the brackets thread: Get everyone who signed up in the check-in thread, and then after that's done, form the brackets, taking all the no-shows into account.[/QUOTE]

Has said check in thread been created yet?

[Ningamer]

Originally Posted by Lamp

Has said check in thread been created yet?

Lite's making it right now.
EDIT: http://www.victoryroad.net/showthread.php?t=3872

[Ditto616]

Sign ins are open, so discussion is now closed!